“...the point was to come together to stand against the common enemy. And this is the lesson that I hope we learn…”
In 1975, Shirley Graham Du Bois, at the time a lecturer in creative writing at Amherst College in Massachusetts, gave a remarkable and wide-ranging interview to Muhammed Speaks, the newspaper of the Nation of Islam. Interviewed by Muhammed Speaks news editor Alonzo 4X, Graham Du Bois spoke of the radical historical upheavals occurring on the African continent, with the success of liberation movements in Angola, Mozambique, and Guinea Bissau against Portuguese colonial rule. She spoke fondly of China, describing it as a “miraculous country” under Mao Zedong. She provided a hopeful statement on the question of Palestine, asserting that as much as they try, they cannot “destroy the spirit of the Palestinian people” – though Graham DuBois was clear: there cannot be peace until there is justice.
All told, the mid-1970s were a hopeful moment for Graham Du Bois: “The so-called Third World has risen,” she proclaimed. Yet she also warned of the continuing threat of US empire, which she described as a “powerful but … wounded beast, and a wounded beast who sees things slipping out from under him all over the world.” It is at this moment, Graham Du Bois continues, that this beast is most dangerous.
Graham also spoke of her own biography. We learn that her father was a minister in the African Methodist Episcopal (AME) church and the founder of Monrovia College in Liberia; that she was a musician, composer, and playwright; that she wrote and produced an all-Black opera (“Tom-Toms”) in 1932; that she was tasked by Ghana’s first president, Kwame Nkrumah to set up the country’s first television network.
Before Shirley Graham married W. E. B. Du Bois, she was already a nationally renowned musician, dramatist, and author. She was an educator and activist in support of Black American rights – writing numerous biographies of Black personalities in the US and Africa. She was also a field representative for the NAACP, and a member of the Communist party. The interview in Muhammed Speaks is a testament to this remarkable woman whose legacy is too often overshadowed by that of her second husband.
We reprint Alonzo 4X’s interview with the great Shirley Graham Du Bois below.
“We have to be together to withstand the fury of this wounded beast…”
Shirley Graham Du Bois, May 2, 1975
Muhammed Speaks: Mrs. DuBois: I know you are extremely concerned with Black history and I’ve heard you say that we, as a people, who’ll be quite concerned with the history we’re making; in your opinion, just what kind of history are we making?
Mrs Du Bois: Well, in some places it isn’t so good. But on the continent of Africa, there is some very, very good history being made. The fact that we have really changed the government in Portugal— you know it was us who changed the government in Portugal; and what has happened in Mozambique, what has happened in Guinea Bissau. Now this was done by the African, and not out of the goodness of the heart or any great change or wisdom on the part of Portugal. It was the African who brought about these changes. I know about the details of these things and these are the subjects I have been concentrating on in many of my speaking engagements.
What I find common in all of these successes over there on the African continent is that the various political and ideological groups have realized that they must struggle together and not fight against one another. I find that this should serve as an example of really what ought to be done in the United States and throughout the entire Western Hemisphere.
Take Angola for example: everybody was saying that they managed to get the Portuguese out of Mozambique because they had one big liberation movement and that they managed to get the Portuguese of of Guinea Bissau because they had one big liberation movement; but they said, in Angola there are three different groups and they quarrel among themselves so they’ll never be able to eject the Portuguese.
But those brothers, they were not so dumb. It is true that their ideology and their methods were different, but when they realized that they must come together, they travelled — and sat down together — to Nairobi, Kenya, and they closed all the doors to everybody but themselves and a few representatives from the Organization of African Unity. And they stayed in that room, shut up; maybe they quarreled but they came out together announcing that they had a unified proposal to present to the Portuguese and that they were leaving together right then for Lisbon to present their proposal, and the Portuguese government accepted it and the date of their independence has been set.
Working together in the face of the common enemy no matter how many difficulties they have later, the point was to come together to stand against the common enemy. And this is the lesson that I hope we learn.
M.S.: Well, there are many Black spokesmen who at least have used that rhetoric, but it appears that unity at certain levels becomes greatly agitated by ideological differences. As a matter of fact, right now, at this point in history, there is strong debate among “scientific socialists” and Pan-African Nationalists: what’s your evaluation of this division?
Mrs Du Bois: If we don’t manage to do better about that we are going to suffer, there’s no question about that. We must use absolute common sense, logic and reason and copy the example of the Angolans.
We have got to be smart; you see the enemy is powerful but he is a wounded beast, and a wounded beast who sees things slipping out from under him all over the world becomes increasingly dangerous. We have to be together to withstand his fury.
M.S.: Mrs. Du Bois, why don’t you tell us a little bit about how you became a resident of Egypt.
Mrs. Du Bois: I went to Egypt, and it’s been my permanent residence since 1966; that was after the coup in Ghana that swept Kwame Nkrumah out. If it had not been for the coup, I would have almost definitely remained in Ghana. My husband and I were invited to Ghana by then President Nkrumah to set up an Encyclopedia Africana.
I was commissioned to set up a television network in Ghana and I set out to learn everything there is to know about television so we could get the best. One very important fact to be noted is that President Nkrumah wanted the absolute best for his people. Well, I want to tell you that we had good television in Ghana and we didn’t have any of this trash that you see on television here.
M.S.: I know that you’ve traveled extensively throughout the African continent and the so-called Third World. What are your views about such countries? I’m particularly interested in China.
Mrs. DuBois: I’m glad you said “”so-called” Third World.” Because as far as I’m concerned the world of the non-white people is in reality the first world, because all civilizations came after them. That just goes to show you how we let other people give us labels.
But to answer your question: I found these countries fascinating. Every one of them, without an exception is beginning to stand up on its own feet and kick out unhealthy influences.
China, itself, is a miraculous country. (You know I was in China right before I came to teach Creative writing here at Amherst in January.). I told some Chinese when I was there, I said, “You know, I’m glad that you’re not an arrogant people and that you don’t think you’re better than anyone else, because there are no other people who have leaders that live as long as yours do.”
Mao Tse-tung and Chou En-lai started out in this last revolution and they're still considered the leaders. They’ve been very fortunate and there’s no historical parallel to that. I had previously never thought about it until this last time I visited China.
And although the Western media has had Mao dying for the last ten years, he appears to be going relatively strong. And even when he dies, I tell you that China is so well organized and those people have such confidence in themselves and in their leadership that the Chinese are not going to go to pieces. There will be no clawing at each other for positions of leadership. China is an efficient, humane and beautiful country.
M.S.: That brings up an interesting parallel: many people said there would be tremendous power struggles when the honorable Elijah Muhammed (May the Peace and Blessings of Allah be upon Him) passed.
Mrs. DuBois: Yes, they certainly did. And they haven't even any evidence of this happening. When you prepare wisely… I was very impressed with what I learned when I was at Temple No. 13 about a month ago. I didn’t realize how much you study, and how seriously the Nation of Islam is taking the matter of tarring their youth. Now, this is going to make all the difference in the world. The training and respect for knowledge that Black Muslims have is something that should be emulated by others. This kind of anti-intellectualism that Black people demonstrate is disastrous. Black People need all of the book learning that they can get. We need it worst than anybody else. And I was very impressed by what I saw at Temple No. 13 in Springfield, Mass.
M.S.: When you talk of learning, I can sense that you have a great reverence for it, and I understand that you are quite a scholar in your own right. Would you elaborate on what you did before becoming Mrs. W.E.B. DuBois?
MRS DuBois: My father was a methodist minister, and he was a man who taught us that we had a responsibility to ourselves and to our people. I was born in Indianapolis, Indiana but because my father was out to reform the church, he was moved around quite a bit — consequently, I was moved around the country quite a bit. I spent a lot of time going to school in Tennessee and the teachers really taught us in those schools. Our father insisted that we should excel in school, that we must excel in school.
M.S.: What schools did you attend?
Mrs. Du Bois: Well, I always studied music as a child and I went to a number of schools. But when I was a certain age, my father — Dr. D.A. Graham — was called to Liberia to start a college for the AME church. He is actually the founder of the Monrovia College there.
So I went to school in Paris, cause at this time I was not going to go to Africa for anybody. Before I actually graduated from college I was teaching music because I had a great deal of training in music. But I entered Oberlin College in Ohio and while I was there I wrote some musical plays and the Julliard Players of Cleveland used my play for the music drama “Tom-Tom.”
That summer I came to Chicago to visit my brother and I found out that the Negro unit of the Chicgo Federal Theatre was just going to be thrown out because they hadn’t done anything. I became very indignant because I knew that the only reason they weren’t doing anything was because they weren’t allowed to—because there were a lot of them with talent.
Well — we took over that theatre and scrubbed and cleaned and put on a number of good plays for a while. But that's my interest, drama, music and creative writing. I’ve also written two books: one on South Africa called Zulu Heart — and the other one on Julius Nyerere of Tanzania.
M.S.: What’s your view on the current situation in the Middle East?
Mrs. DuBois: There is going to be no peace in the Middle East until justice has been done to the Palestinians. Anybody with a grain of sense —they don’t have to be a wise person, but if they know anything about that situation at all, they should know that. Here are a people who have been thrown off their land — and what are they supposed to do? You can call them terrorists — you can call them anything you want; but what are they supposed to do— just sit down on their hands? Just die out? What are they supposed to do?
Of course — terrorists, yes. There was a day when Chou En Lai and Mao Tse-tung had $100,000 rewards on their heads; they were bandits. But they are trying to destroy the spirit of the Palestinian people and that is something they cannot do. You know, there were more bombs that had been dropped in Indo-China that were dropped in both world wars on those people. So, are they conquered?
The so-called Third World has risen and the things that were possible to be done 100 or so years ago are just not possible now.
“‘We have to be together to withstand the fury of this wounded beast…’”: Shirley Graham Du Bois interviewed by Alonso 4X, Muhammed Speaks, May 2, 1975.
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